intervista telefonica...
KATE MOSS: HELLO.
IS: Hi, Kate. How are you?
KM: I'm all right, Ingrid. How are you?
IS: OK. Listen, I know you've had a long day's work, so before we start talking, get yourself comfortable and relaxed. That way we can have a real conversation.
KM: Yep.
IS: How did your career get started?
KM: I was on a holiday [in 1988] with my dad and my brother. We'd been in the Bahamas for two weeks and on the way back had been stranded at Kennedy airport for a night. My dad's mother was getting married in England the next day, and he told the airline. They said them was one last flight with three seats left. I was praying, "Please let us get on that plane." We did. There was one seat in economy, one in business, and one in first class. I was in economy, my brother was in business, and my dad was in first class. Halfway through the flight - the meal had come and I was listening to my Walkman - a man came over to where I was sitting and said, "Excuse me." I was like, "What? What do you want?" He said, "My sister owns a modeling agency and she'd like to speak to you." We ended up having this chat. To this day she's still my agent - Sarah Doukas.
IS: Did you believe these strangers when they said you could be a model?
KM: [laughs] When we got off the plane I told my dad about it, and he laughed. Then after we got home I told my mum and a few days later we were sitting around the kitchen table, and one of us said, "Should we give her a call?" We phoned her up and made an appointment and went on the train up to London to see her. She signed me up. They took some Polaroids, put them in a book, and immediately sent me off on castings.
IS: How old were you?
KM: I was fourteen. At the end of that first day my mum said, "If you want to do this, you're on your own because I'm not traipsing around London ever again like that. It's a nightmare."
IS: What was it like for a schoolgirl from Croydon to suddenly find herself in Glamoursville? Kate, try to go back and remember how it felt, getting off that train, walking in to that agency, and going on those first castings.
KM: I was really nervous. And intimidated by the whole thing - by all the people and all the buzzing, and all the sitting around waiting. I felt really small in this huge place. Now, after years of being in it I know that it's not that big at all. But it felt huge.
IS: Did it feel glamorous?
KM: Yeah!
IS: Did it feel further than your reach? Or unreal? Or beyond your wildest dreams? Did it make sense to you?
KM: I was really excited. It didn't feel beyond my reach, really. I've got pictures of me when I was around eleven, posing. Not with the pseudo-model pose, you know, the arm behind the head and all of that, but like a real model pose. I don't know why. But I did say to my mum, "I don't think I'm very photogenic," and she agreed, "I know. I don't think you are either." I didn't really think anything was going to come of it. But I thought, "Why not?" It wasn't like, "Oh, my God, I hope, I hope, I hope!" It was like, "What a laugh. Have a go and see." I just kind of took my chances, really.
IS: Before that plane trip, had anyone ever said you should be a model?
KM: Well, I was quite thin. And even though I'm not tall for a model, for my school I was quite tall. I was kind of lanky. People would say, "Oh, you should be a model," or something like that. But I'd never really considered it. In fact I thought it was quite vain to say, "I want to be a model." On a holiday I'd taken at an earlier time, I met a girl who said she wanted to be a model, and I was like, "Oh, my God! I would never say that!"
IS: Did you know anything about the fashion world?
KM: I didn't really know that much about it. I suppose I had ideas about it, but I didn't think about it at all. I'd watched model competitions and Miss World on television and things like that, but I wasn't conscious of fashion magazines. I knew teenage magazines.
IS: How long did it take to get a job?
KM: It was on the first week of castings. The job was like a beauty scrub kind of thing. I had no idea of what was going on. There was another girl and she looked like she had been around for a while, to me anyway. She was having her hair and makeup done and I thought, "Oh, my God, what are they doing to her?" Her hair was all funny and I was like, "Oh, no!"
IS: [laughs]
KM: My agent was going, "You don't understand! You got a job in the first week!" When I went back to school, it was kind of a big thing. I was excited to tell my friends I was going to be in a magazine.
IS: Did they pay you?
KM: Yeah.
IS: Can you remember the amount?
KM: Like a hundred pounds.
IS: Did that seem like a lot of money?
KM: Yeah! My God, yeah! And then, basically, it went on from there. I'd go on the train to castings, changing from my school uniform on the train. I carried on like that for a few years, getting jobs in bits and pieces. Then I met Corinne Day, who was doing the casting for a job for The Face [magazine].
IS: Had she started taking pictures yet?
KM: I don't think so. After that we started working together a lot. One job with Corinne always took weeks and weeks and weeks of work. We'd reshoot picture after picture after picture. It was always an ongoing thing. It was never like one day or two days or three days. During that time I kind of lost interest in school. I was never really that interested anyway. I was never academic. I didn't really go to school as much as I should have. [laughs] I went to see my friends. Then I started going up to London a lot more, and going out at night.
IS: What do you think it was that really rocketed you to what happened next?
KM: I think it was those Summer of Love pictures that Corinne took [with Melanie Ward as the stylist]. It was a story that was talked about and that people related to at the time.
IS: Why?
KM: Because it captured what was going on in England at the time. It wasn't '80s glamour. It was about the street. Everyone was saying, "Let's get off our tits and have a laugh. Be more real and not have to grow up so quickly. And have fun."
It was a really exciting time. I was working with Corinne. We were really close friends. I ended up living with her for a while and we'd just hang out all the time. And talk about fashion and what we were going to do and draw pictures. She had very strong opinions and very strong ideas about what she wanted to do. We did lots of the images that she wanted to do. And I think she did succeed in changing things a bit.
IS: Definitely. Her work heralded a very different approach in fashion photography. But keep telling me.
KM: Well, then I met Mario Sorrenti. He was modeling at the time. I was kind of seeing a friend of his, and then his friend went away and he kind of pounced on me. Which is a bit naughty [laughs] but I'm glad he did. We were together and we would do pictures as well, because he wanted to be a photographer. Then I went to New York with him, and met other photographers.
IS: Did New York seem magical?
KM: It felt like a world away. Completely.
IS: Was it a world you wanted to be in?
KM: I didn't know where I really wanted to be and I was quite happy where I was at the time. I lived with Mario for a while, and his mother, Francesca, and his brother and sister, Davide and Vanina, and they became my second family. It was such a nice time. Then I started going back and forth, New York, London, New York, London. . . . I wasn't looking back at all. I was doing tons of jobs. Working, working, working, working. Mario got the Obsession job. We'd been on holiday and taken these pictures that Calvin [Klein] loved. He said, "Go off again and do something for the perfume." We rented this house on the beach on this beautiful island and we had the worst time. [laughs]
IS: You did?
KM: Yes. We fought the whole time. "Obsession" is the way to describe our relationship. Calvin was very clever. He saw that. But we did the pictures and made the commercial, and that really worked. I remember hearing Mario's voice in the other room going, "I love you, Kate. I love you, Kate." And I was like [gasping], "What is that?!" [both laugh] He was like, "Well, it's true, man! It's true!" and I was like, "You're mad!" Soon we split up, and then became really good friends, which we are to this day.
IS: Looking back, it feels like that was all part of chapter one. Chapter two is when your career just exploded.
KM: There was a point when it all really took off and got quite overwhelming, even though I didn't realize it. It looks like my career happened overnight, but it didn't. I was basically living on my own from when I was seventeen on.
IS: And now you're . . .
KM: Twenty-five. And once it started to happen fast, I suddenly felt quite ill. I couldn't get out of bed. I didn't know what was wrong with me. And I went to the doctor and he said, "There's nothing wrong with you. Here's some Valium." And Francesca [Sorrenti] freaked out. She said, "No way! You can't take that." I wasn't allowed to keep them myself. She'd give me like a fraction of a Valium.
IS: Why do you think you had a freak-out?
KM: Because it felt so big. And all of a sudden to get all of this attention, and to be away from home and working all the time was hard. I was on planes all the time. And I didn't see my friends. I cried a lot and was alone a lot. It was quite terrifying, actually.
IS: Kate, often people who don't have this kind of attention don't understand why people who get the attention get screwed up. It's hard to understand why some who seem to have everything - famous singers, actors, models, artists, et cetera - go over the edge. Why do you think people lose it?
KM: I think it's because everyone's projecting onto you, or you feel like everyone is judging you. I felt like that. I feel like I'm being judged a lot of the time. You become really self-conscious.
IS: I remember walking down the street a few years ago and there was a poster of you on a wall. And someone had written something like "Anorexic Scandal!" on it.
KM: Yeah.
IS: I'm sure I'm not telling you something you don't know - that in an effort to raise consciousness about anorexia, and the relationship between images and how they influence us, there were people who knew nothing about you who used you. Can you talk about what that meant - to have your body symbolized and have people making assumptions?
KM: [takes a breath] At first, I got really defensive. I was like, "What are they talking about?" It was upsetting, absolutely. I was a scapegoat. The media had to put responsibility on somebody, and I was chosen. They felt free to say that because someone was thin they were anorexic, which is ridiculous. And just because one person brought it up, then everyone was like, "Oh, yeah! She must be anorexic." And no matter how much I say over and over and over again that I'm not, they don't want to hear it. They want the opposite to be true. And that's even more upsetting.
IS: I'm sure it is.
OK, so chapter three is when you'd gone from being the new kid on the block to one of the gang. To this day you're really good friends with most of the people you hooked up with next, like your colleague Naomi Campbell. That must have been memorable when everyone came together after being on two sides of the modeling fence.
KM: It was. I'll never forget that show season. It was completely mad. It was so much fun, though. I was staying between Christy [Turlington] and Naomi's rooms and it was all limos and the Ritz Hotel and all that kind of business. [laughs]
IS: And you returned to New York and . . .
KM: All of a sudden I was living what is perceived to be the model life. It was just full-on, twenty-four hours a day. It was work all the time, shooting pictures or doing shows. And then there's always a party to go to. There's always a dinner to go to. There're always loads of people around. It was a lot of work and lots of fun. I was having fun working with my friends. For a while it all just kind of rolled together in a great way.
IS: Photographers love taking your picture, and designers love working with you.
KM: I like creating images.
IS: Is it like being an actress?
KM: Yeah, I'm sure it is.
IS: Do you want to be an actress?
KM: Um . . . [laughs]
IS: Have you thought about it?
KM: Yeah, I've thought about it. It is something that crosses my mind, because I feel like I become somebody else when I do the pictures. I don't like doing pictures as myself. I like to be made into somebody different. I like to become someone else. In a picture it's hard to be yourself. But when you're pretending to be someone else, it's nice. It's fun. It makes it interesting.
IS: Talking to you reminds me about this photographer who worked in London last century named Clementina, Lady Hawarden. She'd take pictures of her daughters, who would dress up from outfits they had in a big dress-up chest. It's how they traveled with their imaginations.
KM: See, I do that. I love all of that.
IS: I thought you would.
KM: [short chuckle] I have a dress-up chest at home. I love to create this fantasy kind of thing.
IS: To some people your life is already a fantasy. Johnny Depp and all that.
KM: Yes.
IS: By the way, I've noticed that actors have a real penchant for models.
KM: Yes, actors do like watching girls parade down the runway for some reason.
IS: Anyway, how did you get together with Depp?
KM: I met Johnny just after the CFDA [Council of Fashion Designers of America] awards dinner. We all went down to a bar for drinks and he was there. We were together from the second we met. The first time I went to Johnny's house in L.A. is when I suddenly realized what I was getting myself into. I didn't realize it when we were in New York. I knew he was famous, but I didn't really know what that entailed.
IS: Do you think fame entails something different, let's say, in an actor's world versus your world?
KM: Yes.
IS: Because you're equally famous. That will probably come as a shock to you, but it's true.
KM: Yes, but it's different. I don't speak and he does. People don't hear me talk.
IS: You mean people don't expect you to talk.
KM: Right, they don't expect me to. And when people see an actor speak they think they know him or her. Whereas I'm just a face or a body to them.
IS: Right, right. What about the assumption that because someone's a model they don't have a mind?
KM' It's just one more thing they put on you.
IS: Do you think that assumption is a leftover of sexism and machismo?
KM: Yes. Definitely. And of ignorance.
IS: Would you say It's hard to really survive as a model?
KM: Yes. People think your success is just a matter of having a pretty face. But it's easy to be chewed up and spat out. You've got to stay ahead of the game, actually, to be able to stay in it.
IS: And is part of staying ahead of the game working with photographers and designers with whom you have a creative relationship?
KM: Yes. If you've enjoyed working with people you always get something new from it. In a creative situation it's always going to work. You're going to be able to create something good together. So people who collaborate that way are always going to want to work together, if you can get that.
IS: Kate, it's no secret that you took yourself away for a while, and that you've just gone back to work. One of the things that's been striking is how glad people have been to see you again and to work with you again. Another thing that was striking was that you yourself decided to put a brake on it all in the first place, and check into a clinic. What happened?
KM: It was just a buildup, really. I was definitely living fast. It was "Sleep? Why? Why not go on? There's too much to do. There're too many places to go." I was working, I was traveling a lot. I was playing and I didn't stop. It got to the point where it wasn't so much fun anymore. It all became unbalanced, so one day I just said, "I can't do this anymore. I've had enough." It was getting ridiculous. I was not very happy. I was doing things that weren't good for me. So I checked into the Churchill Priory clinic. It was the best thing I've done for ages. I needed to check in and ask "What's going on?" I had tried to stop certain things before; I had tried to get focused on other things. But I always ended up back in the same place, and it wasn't making me happy. I needed to get the focus back, and ask, "What do I want?" Going on holiday wasn't doing it. That's not real life. I needed to do it in London. Then people found out, and the newspapers went at it and . . .
IS: . . . the headlines.
KM: It doesn't really matter. That wasn't going to stop me from doing what I needed to do to get better. What people say isn't going to stop me. I have to do things for myself.
IS: So far, has it been different since you've returned to work?
KM: Yeah, it is different. It is quite amazing what I didn't feel after a while. I didn't really want to feel things, probably, but it's been amazing what I have been feeling.
IS: Were you surprised to see how many people really cared about you?
KM: It was just amazing. I was amazed at the support that I got when I was in there. And when I came out people knew that I was back on track. For a while I really had lost interest. Suddenly, I was interested in working again. And people could feel it. I've found out so much about myself recently. It's all been a learning experience.
IS: Over the years you must have also learned a huge amount about fashion.
KM: Yes. Now I can walk into a room full of people I don't know and do my job. That's quite a massive thing to learn, I think. To be able to communicate with people.
IS: You seem to really like people.
KM: I do, and I have made some of the best friends that I've got in this business.
IS: So, how would you end this chapter?
KM: It feels great to be in control of myself once again. To be in the moment, not in another moment, or recovering from the last moment. [laughs]
IS: Does it seem amazing to look back at what's happened to you? When you were younger and heard about incredibly famous models who became more than models, but symbols of a time, could you ever have imagined this would be you?
KM: I do stop sometimes in amazement. The other day, I was doing the Versace show in Milan. And I saw Dick Page [the makeup artist] whom I've known since I was fourteen and I said, "Dick, can you believe it? Can you believe where we are?" It's really, really mad when you think about it. And great.
Edited by Ghittablue - 3/8/2006, 19:11
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